Thursday, July 26, 2007

So whether you like it or not, you are dependent on me.

OK, so these types of quotes are easy to find. One doesn't have to listen to many tapes to find this sort of quote:

"The soul is a receiver. The lungs of the soul are apertures designed to receive bible doctrine. Either directly in Bible teaching or in Bible study or through the storage area of the human spirit.

The mechanics of this thing involves several aspects: You can store doctrine in the human spirit and use it later. You can take it directly through Bible teaching; and when you have become mature enough, so that you are spiritually self sustaining you can read and benefit from the Bible, but the worst fallacy in the world is the idea that a born again believer can sit down and read the Bible and derive spiritual benefit. That is a farce and every evangelist says 'Now read your Bible every day and everything will be alright.' and reading your Bible everyday isn't going to mean a thing, you have to be taught. So the greatest farce in the world is that you, a believer, a new believer, can sit down and read the Bible and learn something. That's why the gift of pastor-teacher exists in the church and its a long time before you get to where you can read and understand. When you see a passage you may not understand it, but once you have categories of doctrine, you can identify categories and work it out. So, don't kid yourself, when the day comes that any new believer can open the Bible and become an expert that's the day when we won't need pastors and teachers and I'll go to Hawaii or I'll go back into the service or something. ... So whether you like it or not, you are dependent on me."
Bob Thieme

Who in the world ever said we don't need pastors or teachers? You gotta love this all or nothing logic with this guy. We have pastors and teachers so it must be impossible for anyone to read the Bible and learn from it. Sorry, there is another option. Christian's can read the Bible and grow because the Bible says so and Christian's should also submit themselves to Pastors and teachers within the local church because the Bible says that too. (Acts 17:11, 2 Tim. 3:15-17, Hebrews 10:25) Where did this guy come up with this stuff?

Wednesday, July 25, 2007

Thiemites on the web

Here are some interesting individuals that are Thiemites.

Wow. Toto, we're not in Kansas any more.

Also, here is a forum from a group that investigates cults. Here you can read current and former Thiemites as they interact with one another.

Who said that?

Sometimes its just best to let an individual speak for themselves. These are quotes from Bob Thieme:

"1. No believer can attain spiritual maturity and become an invisible hero or glorify God apart from postsalvation epistemological rehabilitation.

a. This means that no believer can read the Bible and attain spiritual maturity. The Bible is our textbook, but the gift of pastor teacher is designed to communicate the specifics of the mystery doctrine that cause spiritual growth. Doctrine must be learned under authority, and that authority is vested in the spiritual gift of pastor teacher.

b. No believer can read the Bible daily for himself and discover and learn the mystery doctrine for the Church Age, and understand the mechanics of the protocol plan of God. It must be taught through authority. Authority is always the key to teaching. "

Now, there is some truth to these assertions. We do have pastors and teachers for a reason; to teach us and to shepherd us as examples to us. However, to assert that people can't grow and attain "spiritual maturity" by reading the Bible is a rather cultish teaching and completely contrary to both Scripture (Acts 17:11, 2 Tim. 3:15-17) and common sense.